#59: Reconciliation

This week we dig into Genesis 45 and the reconciliation between Joseph and his brothers, then press it into everyday relationships where forgiveness feels costly and messy. We lay out what reconciliation ideally looks like, why it often breaks down, and how the gospel frees us from demanding perfect apologies while still applying wisdom and boundaries. 
• Joseph and his brothers as a picture of reconciliation after deep betrayal 
• the ideal pattern of confession, forgiveness, and restored relationship 
• why overlooking minor offenses can be a mark of maturity 
• going to the Lord first to drain bitterness and gain perspective 
• going to the person directly, asking questions, verifying facts, using a gentle tone 
• avoiding venting, gossip, and passive aggressive distance in church relationships 
• handling more serious sins with the same steps while recognising higher stakes 
• forgiveness as releasing the relational debt, not negotiating repayment 
• forgiving before confession, and not weaponizing “perfect” apologies 
• reconciliation as a process where trust may need to be rebuilt over time 
• applying wisdom: forgiving someone without putting them back in the same role 

Transcript

Welcome And Genesis 45 Setup

SPEAKER_03 0:07

Welcome to Beyond the Pulpit, exploring the life and ministry of Walnut Creek Church downtown. Walnut Creek Church exists to glorify God by making authentic disciples of Jesus Christ who love and worship Him. Hello, all right. Welcome to Beyond the Pulpit. My name is Derek Wadley, and I'm joined by Dan Rude. Good morning, everyone. And Luke Hookie. Hey y'all, how's it going? And uh this last weekend we were continuing our uh series through the book of Genesis. We are nearing the end of Genesis. We are very nearly there. Almost there. Um I think we started chapter one in 2023. Um there's a break between that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But um, so we're getting there. But this last week in Luke, uh, you know, we looked at what seemed to be a story of reconciliation between Joseph and his brothers.

SPEAKER_01 0:57

Yes, yeah. Genesis 45, a lot of things happening in Genesis 45, and probably could take a couple weeks to really work through it. And uh it seems like one of the major themes is that there is like a reconciliation between Joseph and his brothers. Obviously, they've been separated for 22 years at the uh horrible sin of uh their uh of his brothers, you know, selling him into slavery. And and one of the things I got into the end of kind of application is just the idea is there's someone we need to be reconciled to. And I think when we think about reconciliation, there's kind of like there's an ideal, which is what

The Ideal Path To Reconciliation

SPEAKER_01 1:35

was um I mostly presented on talked about on Sunday. And the ideal is that there's you know, in reconciliation, there's two parties, and uh uh someone has been sinned against, and that's fracture the relationship, and so reconciliation is re reuniting, coming back together, and we see that here with Joseph and his brothers, and that I the ideal reconciliation, you need someone, so someone is gonna confess of their sin, own to the wrong they've committed, and then the other person is going to forgive that person for the sin in Joseph's case, forgiving his brothers for the sin they committed. And sometimes we're in both spots, like we've been sinned against and we've sinned, and so we maybe need to do both. But uh the ideal doesn't always happen. And so usually not.

SPEAKER_02 2:24

Usually not.

SPEAKER_01 2:25

So ideally, this is what happens, but you know, there are scenarios like what happens when you try to pursue reconciliation with somebody and they their their confession is like it's not for the exact thing they did, you know. Or um or there's gonna be times when people don't want to, they're just not going to uh they're just gonna kind of they're not gonna want to reconcile. And so I think naturally in our seat, like if we're trying to pursue reconciliation, we can only do so much, and like we can confess where we need to confess or forgive where we need to forgive, um, and the other person has to choose to do the same. Um but we were just talking about before we kind of uh we started the podcast here, like there are definitely situations where okay, this is the ideal, but the ideal doesn't always play out.

SPEAKER_03 3:13

Right. Because of sin, often it doesn't, like more often than not. Yep. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 3:20

So there's there's a uh when we live in a uh fallen, broken world and sin is all over the place, and like you said, we we sin against people and we are sinned against all the time. Um it can make relationships really tricky. And I I've thought about uh over over the years just a few principles about reconciliation and and how this works. And um,

Overlooking Offenses Without Bitterness

SPEAKER_02 3:48

you know, one one scenario is that you're sinned against and um you're s you're sinned against. But Proverbs says, and first Peter says, that it's an honor for a man to to overlook an offense. It's to it's to a man's glory. Um and so there there is a sense in which as followers of Christ we should be quick to give grace to people to to to not take everything so personally. And um there there there there are times where um you know we can be so petty.

SPEAKER_01 4:21

Yeah, like I you say something to somebody and and it was, you know, maybe not gracious, and you can just hold on to that like it's a big deal.

SPEAKER_02 4:30

Yeah, it's like you know, I don't like people with goatees or something like that. And I don't like people with beers. And I I meant you know I'm gonna be able to do it.

SPEAKER_03 4:39

I didn't deliberately did a hard stare at me when he talked about goatees so as not to make eye contact with Luke.

SPEAKER_02 4:45

You cannot look Luke in the eye when you insult him. That's a good that's a good rule for like but you know, if you say something like that and and I'm talking about, you know, of a wild biker or you know, whatever, and it's like you're s you're sitting there and you're like dances, he isn't like pee with goatees, and then you can get all you know hurt, bent out of shape out of that. You know, it's like okay, it is a glory for a man to overlook an offense. Now you could say, hey Dan, um you're dumb. Um some of the greatest people in the world have goatees or whatever. That's right. And um, so you maybe shouldn't say that, but as far as like the yeah, it doesn't have to like fracture the relationship. Just because just because you sin against someone, yeah, that's true. Um, just because there's sin in a relationship, it doesn't have to equal a fractured, broken relationship. Yeah. And it doesn't have to be like this life-changing, you know, oh man, I'm waiting for a confession. You know, it's not it doesn't have to be that. And so I think I think the older I get, the more I see that that truth in Proverbs and First Peter that it it is a glory for a man to overlook an offense. Totally. Um But that but then there are times where sin can be so hurtful, so damaging, that it it does either break a relationship or it it injures a relationship. And um damages. What do you do then? How do you I mean where do you what when someone sins against you, like what do you what do you do then? And it's it's beyond like hey, goatees or whatever. You know, it's something that's maybe more painful. I like people with goatees just for the record. I just want to make that clear. But I don't care if you have a goatee or not. Umustaches. Mustaches, yeah. Even better. Even better, better than goatees. Um, but you know what I'm saying. So what do you do? Right. What's like the first step?

First Step When You Feel Hurt

SPEAKER_02 6:28

Like someone uh maybe it's uh your spouse or a child or a friend or a parent or coworker. And they you just it's like you can't shake it, like you can't overlook it. What's the what's step number one?

SPEAKER_01 6:40

Yeah, I think you know, step number one is just to go to the person and say, hey, you know, what you said or what you did really was hurtful, you know, to me. And um I mean maybe even step one is just to go before the Lord. Go, I think I think that's probably step one is to go before the Lord. Yeah. And uh just express to God how you how you uh feel what's like happened. And I think two, it puts into perspective like when we're sinned against uh that we've ultimately sinned against Christ, and that helps motivate and you know us to forgive the person who sinned against us.

SPEAKER_02 7:17

Um Yeah, so go to the Lord first. Yeah. And you know, something I've learned, it's kind of interesting. There have been times where I feel like someone will say something or do something that I feel offended by and I can't really shake it. And I've often found I've often found it's because there's some truth in what they say.

SPEAKER_01 7:38

That's true too.

SPEAKER_02 7:39

And if you if you jump too quickly to like you hurt my feelings and now we gotta address it, it it's almost like you skip skip the the process the process of like considering what they're saying. That's right.

SPEAKER_01 7:51

Even even if it's not said well, even if it's like sometimes what happens is the way it's delivered, we're more offended by than even what sometimes is said. We just throw everything out. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 8:03

And we just are offended. Yep. And uh it's totally true. So I I think I think just like you know, actually listening and um you know, going before the Lord. And often I found it's like if I pray about it for five minutes and let a day or two go by, it's like whatever. You just kind of move past it. Or I learn something from it from it, or I go thank that person for saying it.

SPEAKER_03 8:27

You like your pursuit of that person becomes instead of trying to be like, hey, you wronged me, it's like actually thank you.

SPEAKER_02 8:34

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. So let's pretend you do step one. You go to the Lord and you're like thinking

How To Talk It Through Well

SPEAKER_02 8:39

through it, praying through it.

SPEAKER_03 8:40

In real life, don't pretend to do step one though. Do step one, do step one.

SPEAKER_02 8:45

Let's yeah. Yeah. So it's maybe like go do step one, go to the Lord, pray about it, think about it. Um okay, what what what's the next step then?

SPEAKER_03 8:56

I think that as the of like the offended party, um, oftentimes like what I I'm unaware of the the fact that sometimes if I say something that is hurtful or whatever, the way that I said it, regardless of the truth content, I'm just kind of unaware of the hurt. And so as the when but when you're the offended party, you gotta go to that person. I think that that Christ was calling it. You can't shake it, you push it. You can't shake it. You can't sit around and wait for them to like uh you know, just figure it out. Like how long should you wait? Are you are we talking like uh like 45 seconds? Does it seem like there's there's a yeah? It doesn't seem I think uh yeah, it's probably kind of arbitrary to pick an amount of time, but yeah, it's like make sure you work through it with the Lord. Maybe it's a a day or two, maybe sometimes it's like a couple of weeks. You gotta like really work through it to get your own thoughts put together and sort through some things, but it seems like that um the offended party is the one who needs to go to the offender and say, like, hey, you know, we had this conversation and you said this and it it really hurt me. And I feel you know, it's like you don't want to like let bitterness fester in your heart, you don't want it to become like a cold shoulder thing, you don't want to become passive aggressive, become passive aggressive slander bitter, which is what happens naturally, naturally, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:30

And I think it's good when you go to them just to even like mm try to establish like the facts of the situation and and maybe just try to understand what what happens. So if someone says, Hey, I I really don't like people with goatees, and Duke's really offended by that, like starting to get offended. That's right. Okay, so like so he's prayed about it, he's trying to shake it. He can't shake it, so he comes to me. It's it's good to say, so like you could start by saying, Hey Dan, I I'm really deeply offended. Yeah, I hate I'm mad at you, I've been harboring bitterness. You could just be angry about it, or you could just say, like, hey, um, I think a couple weeks ago you said you really don't like people with goatees. And I was just wondering, like, what do you mean by that? I'm serious. And because maybe maybe there's a part of the conversation you missed, or maybe I'm having a bad day, or maybe maybe I was being passive aggressive towards you, or maybe I wasn't. And then you give me an opportunity to like respond to you.

SPEAKER_01 11:34

Certainly. You know what I'm saying? You know, coming into conflict or addressing conflict and starting by asking questions to make sure everyone's on the same page. Verifying the facts, like you said, verifying it, it um generally is gonna help things go more smoothly.

SPEAKER_02 11:51

Oh yeah, oh yeah. And it you know, it says in Proverb, Proverbs 15, it says that a gentle tongue breaks the bone. And there's something about um, you know, a gentle gentle tongue breaks the bone, a gentle answer turns away wrath. And there's a there's a way to of responding in humility after you've you drain the poison and bitterness from your heart and you go to the person, and you just give give the person an opportunity to respond. And I can't I I've done that many times in my my life, and I can't tell you how many times the response it goes something like this. Yeah, I said that that's not not what I meant. I was just being stupid. I'm sorry. Or yeah, I said that, and that was really stupid of me. Exactly. Yeah, and I could I could say, well, I was thinking more about like biker gang people, you know, with long goatees. And then I'm like, I don't believe you. Okay, just for the record, I've never gotten a big thing. Luke has no intentions of shooting bands. Okay, let's go. I accept you for who you are, Luke. I'm shooting from my hip from my hip.

When The Sin Is More Serious

SPEAKER_02 12:55

Okay, so I like biker gangs. I like goatees. I'm just giving uh an example. Okay. I would not offend the biker gang community if I was you. Trying to avoid that. That's right. Um so so okay, so let's pretend that the yeah, uh let's pretend that's scenario number one, which is gonna be more common. Um you know, something in that level is gonna be the more common experience within the church. Uh you didn't invite me to this thing. Yeah, uh you made this comment and I and that hurt my feelings. Um, you know, whatever whatever it is. You were short with me. You were short with me. You I felt like you were you just you didn't listen to me at all or whatever that bothers me or whatever. Yep. Um, so that's like one type of scenario. And it seems like usually if people are reasonable, you can work through that. Yep. And it doesn't have to be like this big ordeal process of reconciliation. Okay, but now let's let's go like uh step further. Let's this escalate, you know, uh this go. I don't know what this would be, like grade two, you know, like um, you know, another level up. And you've you you in typically what's gonna be the offense is like when people lie to you, um, they slander you, like you know, I heard I heard that you you you've been saying this about me, you know. Or you know, that's probably the next level. Can you think of something else that's kind of beyond that? Or not beyond that, I'm sorry. What's in that category, I mean, like something that's kind of in that category.

SPEAKER_03 14:31

Yeah, like you stole from me, you yeah, yeah, lying to me, stole from like you took advantage of me. Yeah, whatever it is. Misrepresented. Yeah, misrepresented.

SPEAKER_02 14:41

You know, you got angry, you lost your cool. Yeah, I'd say that would fit in there. Um what do you do there? Yeah, what do you how do you handle that?

SPEAKER_01 14:49

Well, I would say very, very similar. Exactly. And I think it's the exact same way. Just saying, hey, uh I go before the Lord, then go to them, establish the facts, see where it goes.

SPEAKER_02 15:02

Yeah. And just even having a posture of like, I'm I've already forgiven you in my heart, and I w I want to be reconciled with you, and you make it easy to reconcile with you. And um, and I just want to get on the same page. Yep. And but but see, so so often the way that it works, just by way of observation, is there's okay, when I'm offended by you, I you skip going to the Lord and you go to other people, you start venting your frustration. Number two, or then what you do is you show up and you're like hot. You're hot. If you don't, if you sh you may not even show up at all, but like if you do show up, like you're like so bothered by it that it's just gonna go really bad. Yeah, it's gonna go really bad. And I think that's just not the Christian response here in the life of the church. And um, God, God wants us to be righteous even even when we are offended by people. So you do the same thing. So it's like it's almost like that system or that way of thinking, go to the Lord and go to the person, go to the Lord, go to the person, go to the Lord, go to the person.

SPEAKER_03 16:00

That that would save so much pain. Yeah. And something that you said, I

Forgiveness As Releasing The Debt

SPEAKER_03 16:05

don't know if this was uh an original Lou Cookie thought or if this was uh within your study, but the the idea of forgiveness being like the letting go of any expectation of repayment of you know the the debt. And a lot of times it's a relational debt that is created when um there's brokenness in a relationship, but that forgiveness is really the release of that debt. And so if you've you know, if you're go, you know, I found that people are like, I you know, I forgive you for this, but like I need this, this, this, and this. I'm like, but that that doesn't feel like forgiveness necessarily, yeah. Um, because it's like, well, no, I'll forgive you when the debt is repaid. But like genuine forgiveness is a release of the debt, just like the gospel teaches. It's like there the debt that we owe, like our confession to the Lord is never like 100% in its fullness. Like, I don't think that we, yeah, as you mature in the faith, you begin to understand like the gravity of your sin more and more and more and more. Um, but our confession is never going to like meet the fullness of like the standard of God's actual holiness and how we've offended him, but like we are still reconciled, like fully and completely reconciled. And so when it comes to like other people and the forgiveness that we're given, it's like there's nothing that the Lord's like, I'll forgive you if you do this, that, and the other. Yeah. Um, there's all sorts of faith systems built around, you know, around that. But um yeah, the that release of the debt that you feel like that person owes you.

SPEAKER_01 17:45

Yeah, um because for forgiveness is a part of reconciliation, so is it's needed for it, but you you can forgive before you ever are like that person or free let me put it this way, forgiveness and confession, like admission, those things are necessary for reconciliation. Um, but you can forgive a person before they ever confess or admit anything to you, totally, or if they ever do. Totally. Um, and so yeah, forgiveness is in one sense something that can happen isolated from ever really talking to the person. And it should. I mean, Lord willing, we're going to that person that's hurt us. We're trying to mend the relationship because there are different levels here, like you're saying, and there's some things that just like uh selling your brother into slavery that's that's like just automatically breaks the relationship. It's broken. Versus like or you cheat on you cheat on your spouse, cheat on your spouse, or you betray someone, or you punch your spouse, or I mean or your kid, or you there's things that immediately escalate to like where the relationship is, is there's a real brokenness to it. And there's many things which many of us deal with which are gonna be like you said something to me, and it it felt you know inappropriate, or you said it the wrong way, or whatever. So there's those different levels, and as you climb the ladder of severity, uh you're gonna find that there's more brokenness in the relationship. Yes. Forgiveness is gonna be generally harder at times. Yes. And that reconciliation process is gonna be harder, which I do think is a piece of this, is reconciliation oftentimes is a process. It's not totally, it's not just a thing that happens like totally one and done. It can be many times it can be, but there are times when it's gonna be more of a process you're working through.

SPEAKER_03 19:31

And a lot of times when there's the the brokenness in the relationship, part of the reconciling process, you know, especially in situations where there's like abuse or adultery or anything like that, yeah. Reconciliation happens over time as trust is earned again over time. Like there, like that's a reality. Um, and in some cases, it's like you can forgive. It's like you're right. I did say that thing, I was mad, uh, mad at you. And so I said this stupid thing to this other person about you, and this comment. So like I'm sorry about that. And like you can, it's like there, it's like, okay, yeah, you own it, like trust can be just be restored. Um but then it's like there are situations where that that trust has to, it does have to be rebuilt and re-earned. Yeah, um, and so reconciliation is it can be a long process, but it's a process worth pursuing. Totally.

SPEAKER_01 20:22

Um, totally. That's right. Yeah. And now I think you know, you brought up the we were we were kind of just prepping for this, Dan. You brought up the question of, okay, so how does confession and

Joseph’s Model And Imperfect Confession

SPEAKER_01 20:34

mission work here in the reconciliation process? And so you know, because if uh someone sins against me and I go to them and they um or we talk about it and they don't to what degree do they have to admit what they did?

SPEAKER_02 20:47

Yeah, so that's a yeah, there are two stunning details about the story of Joseph that I just I can't shake. I like I can't shake them. Um first, stunning detail number one is that Joseph forgives and heals. I don't mean heals entirely, but he forgives and he heals before he's reconciled to his brothers. Totally. So he is sinned against. I don't know what level that is, but that's that's the top level. Top tier sinned against. And it's not how God has been sinned against, but it's yeah, I mean humanly speaking, humanly speaking is about as bad as it's gonna get. Betrayed by your brothers, you know, you're brothers lie about you dying, your dad thinks you're dead, you know, Potiphar's wife falsely accuses you, you're forgotten about in prison. Like, I mean, this is just it's horrible. Like that's top top shelf, top level, top tier, whatever you want, whatever phrase you want to use. It's you're gonna be sinned against. It's gonna be hard for you to be sinned against more than Joseph was sinned against. I mean, he's he he's the top level. And when you read the story, you see. That he's not bitter. Is there one bitter word from Joseph? No. So he and this is it's stunning to me. Stunning. Pharaoh thinks highly of these guys. You know what that means? It means Joseph never talked poorly about. Joseph never told Pharaoh about what happened. Yeah. And so he I say that because he forgives. The stunning detail that I just I can't shake is that he forgives and he heals before he's reconciled. Now that what does that mean? It means he's not coming to his brothers dependent on them. Now, what's what's dependent on his brothers for reconciliation is that there's gonna have to be some sort of softening change. But he's not like, I can heal when you do the right thing. It's not that he's already been he's been healed by the grace of God. He's forgiven. So what he what that means is that he's positioned as the offended party to act for the good of his brothers. And I think that that is a glorious picture of what Christ does for us. You know, he he he has forgiven us and he's changed us and he's he's made us new. And so what that means is that see, so often in uh broken relationships, and when you're really sinned against, it's that the the broken relationship, it just fractures you so deeply that in the relationship reconciliation process, what ends up happening is that you become dependent on the person getting the confession of their guilt perfectly. You need to understand every way that you hurt me before I can forgive you. And it's in a perfect world, if you sin against someone, you should humble yourself and you should confess what you did to them. But it's just not gonna work out that way. Most of the time that's not happening. Usually it's not happening. So we should be the best Christians should be the best confessors of sin on the planet, which would make us the easiest people in the world to reconcile with. Um but he Joseph is like, he forgives and he's healed before he reconciles with his brothers. That's that's number that's number one. It's just stunning to me. Number two, is that there's no in these stories of reconciliation, like Jacob and Esau, what Jacob did to Esau, his brother, was bad. That was bad, really bad. And when they reconcile, Jacob does not confess his sin to Esau, but they reconcile. And um Joseph's brothers, they I think there is an admission of guilt, like they did something wrong. But they're just not to the same degree of what it does not match what they did. There certainly it does not match. And I think in the story, the way that it plays out is like their guilt is so overwhelming. Um that Joseph actually becomes sympathetic towards his brothers. It's like he's like, This is terrible what you did. In the crushing weight of what they did to him, Joseph is now in the position to comfort his brothers. Yeah. Which I think is just so crazy. And so what that what this is what it means. It means that usually when reconciliation happens, we're not gonna get perfect confessions from people. And we should be so gracious. You know, just like just like the the uh the the way God the Father is towards the prodigal son, you know, where the prodigal he's eating with the pigs, and he he says, I know what I'm gonna do, I'm gonna go back and I'm gonna beg. I'm gonna beg for beg for forgiveness, and maybe I can be a slave in your home. But the moment the father sees the son turn back to him, he runs after him and he restores him. Now, real quick, um, that should be our heart. We also need to apply wisdom. If you run a business and someone, your accountant steals from you. Yeah, you don't just hire a you can you can forgive him and you can actually reconcile with him. You don't necessarily have to trust him, but you don't necessarily have to hire him to be your accountant for your business anymore. That's right. That's right. So um Yeah, so I I think God can restore relationships. Yeah, and he does.

SPEAKER_01 26:09

And I think like to your point with Joseph's Joseph and his brothers, like he wasn't dependent on a perfect confession from them in order to forgive

Wisdom, Boundaries, And Who Should Pursue

SPEAKER_01 26:18

them or for the reconciliation to happen. Totally. Which is important because I think that can be something when we look at reconciliation. If we're not careful, we can kind of weaponize it in a sense of I'm not going to actually be forgive you or reconcile with you unless you perfectly confess what you did. Everything you did that was wrong. And that's just not like you know, Derek, you mentioned this earlier, but like we that we don't even do that with the Lord. We don't do that with the Lord. Like God's expectation of us isn't to do that. His expectation is that we come before him and recognize we have sinned against him, but do we confess every single sin we've we don't even know every sin we've committed against the Lord.

SPEAKER_03 26:54

Martin Luther tried and it drove him crazy, drove him crazy drove him crazy, and it drove the people around him crazy.

SPEAKER_01 26:59

So I think those are those are really helpful observations and points when we're thinking about reconciliation, is that man, it's like um if we go to somebody and they've sinned against and say, You're right, I'm really sorry I did that, in a sense that we should give grace and that should be we we should say, okay, you know, we we accept you, and obviously our freedom is not dependent. And we pursue it. We pursue reconciliation. Well, I think even to too, just real quick to is that um sometimes you know it's the person who has sinned against the other person and they know their brother's offended. Yeah. And you know, Jesus says in Matthew 5, you should go pursue them. Totally. And so I do think um sometimes as the offended person, maybe the person who did something does not know they're they're oblivious to it, and so we should go uh pursue as the offended person. Oh, yeah. But I think there's plenty of situations where I know I've said something and I can tell it's a uh hurt my wife or my kids or somebody else. I'm like, I have a responsibility to pursue them. That's right. And to to be humble and confess to them what I'd said, what I did, whatever that was wrong of me. Would you please forgive me? Um and so uh I think that's like a that's a reality much of the time for many of us. Like, I know what I said was oh, that was not good. That was good. Totally. And so I need to go to them. So I think in the ideal world, you know, it's like uh we forgive, they confess, we're reconciled, but there there is a reality where um oftentimes life doesn't work out perfectly as an ideal.

SPEAKER_03 28:32

And so we gotta look to the gospel as our picture of reconciliation.